Designing a Broadcast Room - Need Infrastructure help - Joel W Smith

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Designing a Broadcast Room - Need Infrastructure help

maltesej

Hi! Glad to have been pointed to this community. Looking forward to trying to see how I can help as well as learn from you all. I have a 2 part question that may be better in 2 posts but lets start here. This is the Infrastructure question. The 2nd will be about camera choices. ;-)

I have a 4 camera setup with a atem switcher and clearcom. I am looking to move my atem switcher and live stream computer to a broadcast room in a separate building. I need to rerun cables and this is what I'm considering, but not sure if I'm missing anything or should go another route.

4 Cameras: BMD Cinema Gen 1 x 2 / BMD Studio Cam Gen 1 / BMD Studio Cam 4k
Switcher: ATEM Production 4k 2 M/E
Storage: BMD Hyperdeck
Encoder: Boxcaster Pro - SDI IN from SWITCHER
Comms: 2 different versions of clearcom units all daisy chained together

My initial Plan:

We have a 150ft conduit that runs between buildings. We have a 150ft run from Cameras to Conduit

Add BMD Camera Convertors to each camera
Add BMD ATEM Talkback Convertor 4k to the Broadcast room for Tally, Comms, PGM return to Cam Ops
Connect Cameras using Tactical Fiber runs back to a Fiber Cassette
Fiber Cassette to Fiber Cassette in Broadcast room via 12 core fiber cable
Fiber then into Talkback Convertor 4k
Talkback Convertor to ATEM.

Might thoughts with this would be that we would then have all the cameras working to the switcher with comms working through BMD along with tally and even future camera control ( depending on the cameras )

I've never done anything like this so all this is based upon research. Would love some feedback or ideas to do it better. Even comments of people who have accomplished this and what you did wrong or right would be helpful. Like any church we are trying to be the best stewards of our money. Blessings, Jimmy

joelwsmith

maltesej

Thanks for joining the community and for reaching out!

It sounds like you're generally on the right track, especially keeping the run between the two buildings fiber. That will eliminate any potential issues with copper lines and power grounding issues.

In theory, what you have planned will work. However, I will say that I would be hesitant to invest in the Blackmagic Design Camera Converters since they have basically been abandoned by Blackmagic for the newer Studio Converters. The original Camera Converters were also not known to be super reliable, and I saw a few issues with them over a few different situations.

I would consider some third-party options that just handle the SDI over fiber part. You'll just need to make sure they keep the SDI ancillary data for tally and all 16 channels of embedded audio for com. Will probably be more robust and will possibly end up being cheaper. I'm specifically thinking of something like the AJA FiDO-4 converters, but I'm unsure on the details about ancillary data and audio.

maltesej

joelwsmith Ok this has me thinking. I had considered the Camera converters because they included Tally and Comms in one unit. I'll search around for some 3rd party Tally Systems and Comms. Thanks, im glad im on the right path!

joelwsmith

maltesej

I'm not sure I understand what you mean. Your Blackmagic Studio Cameras have tally and com built-in. What would be the reason for needing tally and com on the converters?

maltesej

joelwsmith I have 2 Studio cams and 2 Cinema cams ( Gen 1 - gray square cameras with a record button on the front). My understanding is that the Cinemas do not support Tally and Comms built in. The studios do, but Id have to run SDI to and from the camera or purchase the SFP module to run fiber directly into the camera. Did I miss understand something i read?

joelwsmith

maltesej

Got it. Sorry, I read your original post as having 1 Cinema Camera and 3 Studio Cameras.

Your understanding is definitely correct.

So your Cinema Cameras are manned?

maltesej

joelwsmith we run with 4 camera operators. I am in the place right now though were I'm looking to replace the older cinema cams. They were purchased and purposed before my time with my church and weren't the correct camera for the live application. I was considering adding 2 more studio cameras or doing ursa minis. I guess either would have comms and tally built in.

joelwsmith

maltesej

Cool. That decision would probably help dictate what options you choose for fiber then.

If it were me, I would consider third-party fiber solutions if they are around the same price or cheaper compared to the proprietary Blackmagic converters. That way there is more flexibility and possibly more reliability. Blackmagic's fiber products haven't necessarily been shining stars in the industry. They work, but there's always some caveats or they cut some kind of corner to keep the cost down.

maltesej

joelwsmith Sweet! Thanks so much! Either way though, I will need the BMD Talkback Converter to make it all link up correct?

Any other brands of Fiber converters that you know are reliable besides the one you linked above as a possibility.

As for cameras, i'm going to search the community for recommendations and as to what the difference are. But...if you have a link or suggestion that would be helpful as well.

joelwsmith

maltesej

Either way though, I will need the BMD Talkback Converter to make it all link up correct?

Not necessarily, that was one of the main reasons why I thought a third-party solution may be better for reliability. If you use Blackmagic's intercom through the ATEM, you don't necessarily need the Talkback Converter if the fiber converters you get keep all 16 channels of SDI audio. Blackmagic's intercom uses channels 15 and 16 of SDI embedded audio to do 2-way intercom, one channel for talk and the other for listen.

Any other brands of Fiber converters that you know are reliable besides the one you linked above as a possibility.

Some good brands to look into for fiber solutions are AJA, Telecast (Rattler), Thor, Cobalt, Lynx Technik, and MultiDyne.

As for cameras, i'm going to search the community for recommendations and as to what the difference are. But...if you have a link or suggestion that would be helpful as well.

I have a list of cameras I recommend and there have already been some good discussions in the community about cameras as well. But the community is only a couple weeks old, so there's not a ton yet.

Here's my list of camera recommendations: The Best Cameras For Live Streaming

maltesej

joelwsmith I totally get it now.. Ok.. I forgot the ATEM also has talkback capabilities built in.

This is a great start for only being a couple weeks old. thanks again for the conversation and helping me think through this stuff.

joelwsmith

maltesej

Thanks again for joining!

Keep me posted on things you learn or decide. I would be interested what decisions you make and why.

maltesej

Hey Joel! so here is my gear list. I think im going to go 2 SDI out from the cameras to a closer location then fiber over to our broadcast room.

What do you think of this gear list?

Cameras

BMD URSA Mini Pro 4.5k G2 -
Canon CN-E 70-200mm T4.4 Compact-Servo Cine Zoom Lens (EF Mount) -
BMD Studio ViewFinder -

To connect to the broadcast room: SDI from the camera to Fiber Converter then Fiber to the room and converted back to SDI:

-BMD Mini Converter Optical Fiber 12G -
-6G SFP Module -

For the Fiber Run between buildings:

-Fiber 12 Core Fiber Cable 150ft - MTP on each side
-Fiber MTP to LC Breakout Cables for 12 Core - One for each side of the cable or
12 Fiber MTP/MPO (female) to LC Duplex Singlemode Cassette?
-BMD 12X12 Smartvideo hub - to bring program feed back from atem to cameras PGM

joelwsmith

maltesej

I think you're on the right track. Looking pretty good!

I can't see any potential issues with this setup at first look. Just be sure to test everything before installing/running cables. 😄

How far will the cameras be from stage/subjects?

maltesej

joelwsmith Hi joel! The distance is about 60ft. do you think those lenses will be enough?

joelwsmith

maltesej

200mm on the URSA Mini Pro 4.6K G2 will get you a medium wide shot from 60' away. That's about knees up on a 6' tall person.

70mm on the URSA Mini Pro 4.6K G2 will get you a framing that is about 25' wide from 60' away.

I'm not sure what your expectations are, but that info may help.